Mastering USA Market Entry Through Strategic Vision and Leadership with Jennifer Quigley-Jones

00:00 - Jennifer (Guest)
I think a lot of founders worry that if they let go of their business or let go of clients, it's going to fall apart. If you feel that way, you haven't hired people you trust. I love handing off clients to my team. It's one of my favorite things because I know they can manage that process better than I can. I want to think about this industry. I want to see the strategic vision parts of this industry. I want to take the agency forward by thinking about innovation and what the industry needs. My aim as a founder is I want to be out of the day-to-day.

00:30 - Mike (Host)
My name's Mike Lander and you're listening to Higgle, the B2B sales club podcast, where we bring you actionable insights about sales, RFPs, negotiations and difficult procurement discussions from sales leaders, brand leaders and procurement leaders. Please subscribe to get updates when new episodes are released. Jenny, thanks ever so much for rejoining me on Higgle, the B2B sales podcast For the listeners. If you haven't listened already, you really definitely should listen to Jenny's last episode with me. It was genuinely really insightful, very straightforward and a lot of fun, and I've had a lot of people commenting on that episode, so go back and listen to the one before with Jenny. This one's about basically US expansion and that's going to be a really fascinating story. But before we get into it, jenny, remind people who are you, what do you do? And a new question for our guests is what's your favorite song and why?

01:24 - Jennifer (Guest)
Thanks, you know making it personal there, Mike. I'm Jenny Quigley-Jones, the founder and CEO of Digital Voices, one of the world's leading marketing agencies, and my no, this is a real curveball. My favorite song, the song that gives me all the feels, is so Far Away, by Carole King, Because I on the tiptoe.

01:43
I can expand into the US. I spend a lot of time traveling internationally and spent a lot of time studying in the US when I was younger as well, and so my mum used to listen to that song and miss each other, and she listened to it at uni. So then I and yeah, it reminds me of her all the time- and we saw Girl. King live together. Who is?

02:00 - Mike (Host)
That'd be amazing. And the reason I ask the question is it's often quite emotional for people. Music has a way of bringing us back to an experience or a time when something happens. Yeah, I'm a huge music fan, our family is, and our son sat down the other day. Vicky was going out for something and he said oh dad, I don't want to have you on your own, I'll come and sit with you and we'll listen to some music and we'll sit and look at some annuals of his kind of like of his life. And he put on Jimi Hendrix because he's a big Jimi Hendrix fan.

02:28
You raised him right yeah exactly Brilliant, but that kind of stuff he won't forget, and neither will I, anyway, moving on with the question. So, jenny, let's talk about music. Much more interesting so, geographic expansion. I know my audience genuinely are fascinated by insights about how to successfully enter the US market when you're not, when you're a kind of UK European business predominantly at the start. So, entering the US market and, more importantly, how do you create the conditions for long term growth? Many try, many enter. Very few are sustainably growing in the US. So kind of over to you really, and we'll have a chat about it.

03:11 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yeah, we can definitely chat about it. So I started my business eight years ago with £500 that I put into the business bank account and I had £10,000 in savings. So we had five years of the business before we expanded to the US. So we expanded to the US about three and a half years ago.

03:27
I sought a lot of advice before doing it from other UK founders and my favorite piece of advice was from the CEO of Jungle Creations, jamie Boulding, and he said expect that you're going to go out there, you're going to learn a lot, you're going to try really hard, it's going to be really expensive and you are going to come back with your tail between your legs in a year, because that tends to be what happens in the US. I think a lot of UK founders have the language experience. You consume so much US culture that you feel like you can be part of that and also like the accent does get you listened to, which is great. I would agree, yeah, but I think people don't plan enough before they go into the US and expand into the US. I also don't think they allocate enough budget. They say three crucial things. One it is way more expensive than you expect. So we expanded with retained profits from the company. So instead of taking money out and buying a house, you didn't draw dividends, you left money in.

04:19
Perfect Left money in. So we split half into building tech, which I'll talk about later, and half into expanding to the US. So our budget for that first year of US expansion was $400,000.

04:29 - Mike (Host)
Wow, of your own personal money. So we're clear to the listeners Of the retained company money Retained profits. Yeah, and you're obviously. I don't know how much, but you're a majority shareholder, so it's predominantly your company. Wow, well done, keep hold of it. Keep hold of that. 94.4%, definitely.

04:54 - Jennifer (Guest)
Thank you. It's interesting because when we were first discussing America, my CFO sat me down and was like right, we've got this amount of retained profit, what do you want to do? And she was like do you want to take it out? Buy a house, what do you want to do? Like you've put, everything you've made has kind of gone back into it, and you you've like I feel like sometimes I keep doubling down and putting yeah, and there is a time to go.

05:07 - Mike (Host)
Actually, I need to de-risk this a little bit for myself.

05:10 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yes, she was like do you want to de-risk your life? And I was like, actually I think I want to take half that money and expand into the US and half it and build tech. And she was just like Jenny. That wasn't what I meant, but okay. So the $400,000. We applied for an E2 visa, which there's a really great scheme so a lot of partner countries can apply for it from select countries. The UK and the US have this E2 investor visa scheme. So you have to put together a business proposal and then it does take for the visa. I'd say it took about nine months a year. So in that business proposal you have to essentially show because I didn't realize people get turned down for this, so I know multiple UK founders who've been turned down for it you have to show that you're investing a significant amount of money so at least $100,000. And you have to have really detailed plans for where that's going. You have to show that you're planning on hiring in the US. So you set up a subsidiary. We have a Delaware subsidiary Delaware.

05:58 - Mike (Host)
Everyone seems to do Delaware exactly. Yes.

06:01 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yeah, I think there are some contractual reasons. And then you have to put together this proposal, take it to the embassy and kind of go through a short interview. I think the lawyers were about $10,000 or something and we sponsored one of our employees to come out as well. So I'll talk about this in a minute, but one of our employees came out too. My interview is quite simple because we have this very extensive document. The people who I have known have been turned down have been turned down after that interview. So don't under-prepare for it. Don't have a half-assed document. It won't work. So that first, $400,000 covered the legal process fees, the setup fees, accountancies, payroll, HR, suppliers, salaries. So I went out for a year and I rented a corporate apartment in New York for the year, which is insanely expensive. A lot of UK founders try and do it where they hop in and out. Americans work that out. I've had Americans in business meetings say to me which cross streets do you live at? I want to know you're really here.

06:58 - Mike (Host)
So if you're thinking as a founder, you can just like flit in and out. So lesson one prepare really well the documentation and prepare for that interview.

07:03 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yes, prepare for the interview, prepare the finances. So if you're hiring people, make sure you have money allocated for their salary.

07:09 - Mike (Host)
And lesson two is don't flit in and out of the US, Don't treat it as a oh, I'll go for three weeks and come back.

07:15 - Jennifer (Guest)
America is the center of the world and to them, every case study you show them that is not an American brand or an American case study, they will not revere or understand. We had some great stuff we'd done in Germany, we don't care. They want to know that you truly are committed to US culture, us way of life. So definitely move, and I think a lot of founders in the UK don't really want to uproot their families or move. You just won't, even if you are.

07:42 - Mike (Host)
Get really really lucky you won't crack the US market yeah.

07:44 - Jennifer (Guest)
If you hire a great MD in the US, the chances are a great salesperson, the chances are you still won't. Without that founder presence, without that founder narrative, you won't convince them to work with you. I would say, on preparing a founder narrative, america is very different to the UK. If you go into the UK with the narrative you need to succeed. In America it's like I'm the underdog. I've given it all I can. Here's the rough background I've come from. Here's you know. Here's the struggles I've been through. Here's what I want to succeed. Here's my big vision. That doesn't sell in the UK. People don't like that. They feel like they're being sold to, they feel like you're challenging the status quo. They really you can't speak like that and do well in the UK, in America. That's what you need to do.

08:23 - Mike (Host)
They love it.

08:24 - Jennifer (Guest)
They love it. They love an underdog story. They're inherently so much more capitalistic than us and so they love a founder. So think about what your story is, think about your pitch. Think about Dan. Priestley talks about this. He says think about what your 30 second, two sentence intro is. If, after you've said that intro to someone, they don't go oh that's interesting. And ask you more questions. You've got your pitch wrong. Redo it so.

08:46 - Mike (Host)
Very, very good point.

08:47 - Jennifer (Guest)
Mine is something like I'm Jenny. I founded one of the fastest growing influence marketing agencies in the world. Actually, in the UK, even though I founded it at 500 pounds, we're the only any form of diverse run agency like run, founded and run agency with more than eight figures of revenue a year. Wow, and Americans go. Oh, I want to hear more because they like it.

09:05 - Mike (Host)
I want to hear more.

09:05 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yeah, In the UK they're like oh, shut up, that's a bit arrogant. Why are you talking about that?

09:11 - Mike (Host)
Just remarkable, isn't it Exactly?

09:13 - Jennifer (Guest)
Know your role as a founder, know the pressure you're going to be under and be prepared to do that or don't Like. If you can't give that, walk away. If you're too in business so you need to be in the UK every day, don't do it. Or hire in the UK to do that, to do the job you're doing, and then you go. You'll always be the best salesperson. Next tip when you're thinking of hiring, set aside realistic budgets for hiring. Hire people full time. Again, you need someone who's not freelancing on multiple projects. Take the investment. So be very aware that anyone out of college who's good will be $55,000 a year salary. So it's not, especially if they're in one of the cities, and that's not even highly qualified. We have account managers who are on over $100,000.

09:54 - Mike (Host)
So for me, interesting question. Hopefully it's for the listeners as well. I've had clients that have gone into the US market and how they've got in is a big brand's been working with them. That brand's global. They've worked in Europe and the brand's taken them into the US. They've set up, established and then they've expanded from there. That's one approach. Another is you do what you do. You say you invest, you employ and you go out there and you wear away your shoe lather and you build a client base. What was your approach, or is there a third way?

10:23 - Jennifer (Guest)
Multiple things. So that first way is a great approach. Just make sure you're not undercharging for staff, because if you do, your costings based on UK costs it won't work.

10:34
Just to say that. The final thing that I think is crucial if you're going to go out there, I spoke to Emma Harmon, who runs Whaler. That's a competitor of ours. They're a great influencer and agency. They've been around for a very long time. Emma said that be careful when you expand to the US. Make sure your processes match. So don't go and reinvent the wheel in the US because you're going to have all these problems and the clients will fall apart.

10:57
So I bought one of my most process oriented clients who had run campaigns in the UK. I bought her to America. So Chloe has been such a like foundational part to the growth because it means I can do the sales and I can focus on that and then she can make sure everything is matching based on our processes. We also we don't have separate P&Ls, so we have sometimes some of the work the client facing work will be done in America. Some of the work that doesn't have to be client facing will be done from the UK. So our tech is built in the UK. We have a team in Costa Rica as well. Think about what you need to invest in for those big US salaries and then be really smart with how else you can use your resources so that I would say, blueprint for expanding to America.

11:39 - Mike (Host)
So I want to just take a pause for a second and go back to the UK. When you move to the US and you're fully committed and you're building the US business, if you look back over the Atlantic and go, what's happening in the UK, how do you stop the UK from falling apart whilst you, as the founder and the visionary and the leader, has gone to the US? How did that work.

11:58 - Jennifer (Guest)
So that's such a fear and I think a lot of founders worry that if they let go of their business or let go of clients, it's going to fall apart. If you feel that way, you haven't hired people you trust. I love handing off clients to my team. It's one of my favorite things because I know they can manage that process better than I can. I know they think better in terms of ad agency world than I do, so we had a really strong senior leadership team before I went. I want to think about this industry. I want to do the strategic vision parts of this industry. I want to take the agency forward by thinking about innovation and what the industry needs. My aim as a founder is I want to be out of the day-to-day because if you can build a successful company that way, if not, you're building a vanity project.

12:42 - Mike (Host)
Absolutely.

12:42 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yeah, so we had really strong processes in the UK. We also we already had clients that were not in the US but had run campaigns in the US, so that one of our biggest clients is in Lithuania and they are a global brand. They're Surfshark, so their sister company to NordVPN, so they have eSIMs, they have VPNs. They're actually Lithuania's second ever unicorn, which is such a cool project to grow Like virtually six years. It was great. So we took their case studies for the us and could use that in america. So people had that. So we already knew that our processes worked, for running us campaigns last being out there and having client services people out there would be a cherry on the cake, but we knew fundamentally that we could do it from the uk and it could be very controlled. So then that gave me the time and the confidence confidence.

13:28
Yeah, and the confidence.

13:29 - Mike (Host)
To say you could focus on the US.

13:31 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yes, the other question. So you asked about sales and that strategy as well. You need to be so willing to talk to everyone. It's interesting as a founder as well, because you get to the stage where you get very comfortable, especially if you've been a UK founder for five years. I was like God, I'm done with like scrappy networking events. Yeah, Then you go on your back at square one.

13:51 - Mike (Host)
You are back exactly.

13:53 - Jennifer (Guest)
And your audience is so much more skeptical because they've seen loads of UK founders go say they're in America. They're not really.

14:00 - Mike (Host)
And then they bounce off the sides and they go back again.

14:01 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yes, and they're really disappointed and they probably have trust issues, very, very justifiably. So it's interesting. You have to be very willing to have these conversations, you have to be willing to really put yourself out there, you have to be willing to be scrappy. Honestly, one of our biggest clients now I found on. This sounds really weird. This sounds so, so creepy.

14:21
I was in Soho House between meetings so I did like seven meetings a day. Back to back people coming to Soho House, I was like I'll buy you coffee, I'll buy you lunch, just come talk to me. And between meetings it shows you who else is on the app so I and it shows you their LinkedIn, if they, you know, if they add it, or their Instagram. And I saw this guy who worked in marketing and a really big brand. I sent him a message on LinkedIn saying hey, did I see you at Sarah's house? And then he was like yeah, you did. Yeah.

14:46
And I was like we're both in marketing, just thought we should talk, and he on a Sunday he was. So we're both in marketing, just thought we should talk, and he on a Sunday he was. So first we did a call and he was about to go on holiday to Liberia, of course. Great, very interesting guy. So he had this very interesting call and then he said, oh, if you really want to talk about this, when I'm back from holiday we should have a coffee. And that coffee ended up being on a Sunday and I was like, oh my God, what if he thinks this is a date like this is so awkward yeah exactly.

15:09
We sat down and he quizzed me on marketing. He quizzed me on like who's out of home do you like? Who? Do you think google's really competing with apple? How do you think samsung's play? He was so intensely careful about his work, he loved it. And then he said at the end of that coffee he said, actually, I'll introduce you. We are looking for an influence marketing agency. You've just passed the test. So yeah, I think it's really interesting. You have to be willing to just do these things that humble you and really do so. So how do you generate leads.

15:36 - Mike (Host)
You talk about seven meetings a day, which is a hell of a. It's a sprint every day, which is really hard.

15:41 - Jennifer (Guest)
Seven meetings after you've done like four or five UK calls.

15:45 - Mike (Host)
So it's quite yeah, it's an interesting day, so your day is really stretched, so you're doing like 16, 18 hour days on a regular basis. I was how do you generate leads? Everyone wants to know and I've got loads and loads and loads of podcasts about this how do you in the US, as a startup in the US, very well established in the UK and Europe, how do you generate leads? What's your personal? Because you were the sales, predominant sales lead in the US.

16:10 - Jennifer (Guest)
At 70 people. We don't have anyone doing sales. All of our leads are referrals or inbound.

16:14 - Mike (Host)
Wow, yeah, and I don't do that much in terms of proactive. Did that happen in the US? So how did it work in the US? From a zero base of customers, how did you get to generate meetings?

16:25 - Jennifer (Guest)
So we've always been very so. There are two very different schools of thought in the US there are people who predominantly spend like 60 of their company employee spend goes to sales people and they basically build really strong sales orgs. Those people are entertaining, entertaining, entertaining. Every sports game, every. They are everywhere, every conference. They can drink till one of my.

16:45 - Mike (Host)
I'm so impressed by those people.

16:47 - Jennifer (Guest)
that's a very hardcore type of sales and it does work in the US. The interesting thing is, for that model to work, those brands need to hold on to their clients and often if you're spending so much money on the sales portion and not on the rest of your team, your customer experience isn't great. So we are on this other side, which is more consultative in terms of the way we do sales which I think, having spoken to you, you're probably yeah, that's me absolutely longest sales deal.

17:19
I think was 10 years. That's my longest gestation period. Yeah, that is 10 years. You build a relationship.

17:22 - Mike (Host)
You build a trusted relationship.

17:23 - Jennifer (Guest)
It takes time and it's also, it's not always the right time to work with you. You're right, it's yeah. We just had a chat. We. We just decided we got turned down by my dream brand in the world. I used to work at them as well, so I don't want to say but it was really interesting, because it really isn't the right time for them. They're not ready for scale. They're ready for their testing, their in-house testing. So it's interesting. It's like don't be upset when you get these no's. So our approach is more marketing led. So we'll do a lot of private dinners for people around conferences. I do a lot of kind of LinkedIn posting and, like I, to me it's like give out all the information you have for free, so share reports.

17:57 - Mike (Host)
Same here, absolutely, yeah yeah. The value is not in the documents and the words. It's in your experience and your insights and your ability to execute for them.

18:07 - Jennifer (Guest)
That's what they want.

18:08 - Mike (Host)
Yes, the hook is the content.

18:09 - Jennifer (Guest)
It's really interesting as well. On the business model we talked about previously, the guaranteed results do help in the US. It's really interesting. No one's doing it in the US. To me I'm like we do it in 36 markets. How on earth is no one doing it in the US? So that does help build trust because you say to someone look, I want to make this zero risk for you. I appreciate we're a new company you're taking a chance on. Here is how our entire business model is trying to ensure we win together. So that again builds into that. Ties into that consultative selling, conferences. Speaking at conferences is really good in the US and it's expensive.

18:40 - Mike (Host)
So is it a pay to play? You have to pay to speak.

18:43 - Jennifer (Guest)
Most of the time, yeah yeah, if you bring a client sometimes on stage who's a big name so I spoke at Fast Company with Expedia they will then let you. They won't let you exhibit, but they'll let you be there for free. But, to be honest, if you want to close the deals, you need to be exhibiting as well, so it ends up quite quickly costing you money. So you can spend up to 40 grand on a conference.

19:04 - Mike (Host)
But you gave away a nugget which I've used before, which I thought was really interesting. Let's just go back to the nugget for a second and dig it out the ground. You said that we have dinners around conferences. So my interpretation of that is when you go to a conference and your ICP is at the conference en masse at scale, well, they're there already. So if they're in town and they probably haven't got much to do in the evening and it's a two-day conference, invite them out to a private dinner with an anchor, some sort of draw, and you and they'll go. Sounds great, nice dinner, nice place. Meet my peers, have a discussion.

19:35 - Jennifer (Guest)
And it has to be a nice place because there's a lot of competition to do that now.

19:38 - Mike (Host)
Right, Everyone's cottoned on, have they?

19:40 - Jennifer (Guest)
A lot of people yeah, so it ends up being either has to be a really nice place or an interesting topic. It's funny we did an event at South by Southwest, so we have two large events we work at every year. For the last three years, Cannes and South by Southwest Done a lot of smaller conferences as well.

19:55 - Mike (Host)
Do they work for lead gen? Seriously, yeah, Relationship building lead gen Do they actually? Yeah?

20:00 - Jennifer (Guest)
You get the right seniority of people.

20:01
I would say Cannes more than South by, but yeah, you get the right seniority of people at Cannes who will actually spend to spend time learning. Again, unless you're hosting a really nice dinner or a yacht, they're not going to come. So you do have to invest, but it's worth it. But yeah, we had someone at South by Southwest who, again, is from a really large healthcare brand and he had been to loads of influencer events. So he actually went to our breakfast panel and had breakfast with us, then went to have lunch with the founder of one of the biggest competitors in the US, one of the largest players, and then I said oh, you know, you seem nice, come to our dinner. And he actually, having only met us that day, decided to give a toast, which was I had no idea what he was going to say and he said I just want to say that it has been a real pleasure to be somewhere where every aspect has been thoughtful, because you never see how you stack up versus this hardcore sales model.

20:52
It's like every single aspect feels curated. It's so that there's learning, it's so that there's substantive discussion. We're not trying to get people drunk at these events. You can do that and it does work for some people. We're not necessarily like come play golf. What we're trying to do is say, hey, we want to work with the best in the industry and we really care. Sorry.

21:09 - Mike (Host)
For anyone listening. All of a sudden three thumbs came up when Jenny was talking, so obviously it's the See. What happens now?

21:17 - Jennifer (Guest)
No see it doesn't, I know. Literally just the thumbs. There you go.

21:21 - Mike (Host)
Ah, oh, my God, sorry, I'm now in a rave with Jenny. Well, that'd be exciting.

21:26 - Jennifer (Guest)
Well see, that's not what I do for entertainment for clients, sadly. What I find really interesting is it's that if you want to make the industry better, you just have to know your ICP is going to be a really ambitious marketer. It's going to be the ones who want to take a chance on someone doing something differently. So all of your service needs to reflect that. The people who are coasting, who just want an easy life, they're going to go to. They're going to work with the agencies who are known entities, who they've been told to they won't get fired for working with. They're going to enjoy the golf, which is completely fine.

21:54
It's just not how we necessarily show up. I would also say what's really interesting for us is both. There are two really big agencies, one in the UK and one in the US, that do this type of like hardcore sales approach. We find that everything they invest in sales comes back to us because we're a great second agency once you've trialed with them but you're like so influencer marketing is what we want to do, but we want to do it better.

22:14
They essentially paid for our sales funnel fantastic so it's, don't worry about being too impatient, don't get FOMO from so I want to talk to you about patience.

22:23 - Mike (Host)
How long did it take when, after you'd kind of set up in the US, how long before things really started to pick up and that you started generating proper recurring retained revenue?

22:33 - Jennifer (Guest)
The first year I think we made it well. We had that investment put aside, so we made a loss that year and then the second year was profitable. We can't really because we're not p-backed, we can't, or part of a large group, we can't really afford to take risks that don't pay off. You kind of have to. You have to like fail fast and pivot. So, yeah, we've tried some things that didn't work. Like we invested in a networking group in the US. It was like $34,000 membership a year, wow, and it was like I know it was a great group to be a part of but it didn't drive one sale and it was already really saturated with other influencer agencies. But we found other things, like joining the Association of National Advertisers has helped us and that's a much cheaper investment, so test and learn.

23:11
Yeah, test and learn and also just be really willing to pivot. It's also the really hard thing about the US but it's really good for a founder for me is that people are so easy to let go. So the thing is. But it's really good for a founder for me is that people are so easy to let go. So the thing is, it does make sense to scale up your team and then cut them if, which is partly why they're paid more, because they have less security.

23:30
Yeah, it's like two weeks. I mean some people, two weeks is a lot and I would never advocate for that type of yo-yo hiring and firing. But if you have a client that has an intense need and that client disappears, you can change tack quickly. So I would never, ever do something like that lightly. But there have been points we've had to make really hard decisions and we've been points where we've had to say hang on, which roles are essential to be in?

23:51 - Mike (Host)
Yeah, yeah. So I'm conscious of your time, Jenny. Just draw it together for me.

24:06 - Jennifer (Guest)
So like what? The kind of the three? They're already established in the UK and Europe. What are the three big lessons do you think? Make sure you put an investment bucket aside. It doesn't have to be 400 grand, but at least 250.

24:12
Do that, secondly, really be critical on what needs to be done in the US? How can you build trust? The thing that has to happen is a founder has to be out there full time. So, apart from that, what other roles could be done in the UK? They need client servicing in the US, they need US accents, but what can you do where you can essentially build an MVP that will work and make the client happy but also mean that you're not over-investing?

24:32
And thirdly, the most powerful sales tool in the US is bold ideas and vision. They want someone different. They are much more willing in the UK to take chances. So what can you do in your offering that makes it feel worth it for them? What can you show them that's like, hey, this is your chance to do it right now, before everyone else does, and I think that's. It's been a real pleasure in the US actually, and it really reinvigorated the way I felt about my own business as a founder. There is nothing better than being in New York around people who are like, who just have so much drive to do something bold, and that makes you excited as well. So like that, yeah, in the UK it's not the same and honestly it was, it's not.

25:14 - Mike (Host)
We have tall poppy syndrome. Yes, we do. We'd rather chop you all down to the same size so that we all look the same, whereas in the US that's a bit of a genericism. I don't mean that generically, but we have a tendency in the UK to certainly feel like, oh you know, they're showing off a bit, whereas in the US that's not true. It's the opposite. They like bold and brave.

25:32 - Jennifer (Guest)
Yeah, when I did my scholarship, so I did my master's in the US on this really generous scholarship, because otherwise I could not afford it to do this master's. And before we went, this master's, and before we went, the chairperson of a scholarship group said by the way, don't make self-deprecating jokes in America because they'll take you seriously, whereas in the UK we're just champions of it, we shrink ourselves. This was a personal development for me. But moving to the US made me realize I wasn't at home in the UK anymore. I mean, it changed a lot in my life. It changed my relationship because I was with someone who was very British, who lived in, but anyway who's. I became too much, because it woke up a whole sense of my ambition and the idea of possibilities that I'd kind of just shut off in my brain. So I don't know. I'd also say, like, be prepared for it to reinvigorate or to change you in some way, but lean into it.

26:15 - Mike (Host)
So what's the most fun thing? On that point, just to close, what's your most kind of fun? We talked about experiences at the beginning music. What's your most kind of fun? We talked about experiences at the beginning. Music's an experience. What's your most fun experiential memory of entering the US? Forget all the hardships and the ups and downs. And what was the most fun thing? Where you go? That was amazing.

26:31 - Jennifer (Guest)
There are two. At the end of our first year we took some potential clients out for a lunch, and then we put Digital Voices logos on a helicopter and we did a sunset helicopter ride over New York with some of our clients and it was really it's really that was. You're looking out the window to celebrate a successful year and it was, yeah, one of those moments where you're like I'm not going home.

26:55
You know, when you hear that was amazing and, to be honest, like it was really interesting because one of the people who was on the helicopter was a potential client and he said, oh yeah, we don't have budget, which completely was fine, like I really liked his brain, he was wonderful. And then he got off the helicopter within five minutes, was like, yeah, so I think I've got a campaign. Oh my God, this is insane. The helicopter ROI is always positive.

27:22
And then the second thing was in South by Southwest for our first year we were looking there was something called brand innovators. They're a really, really big group where you can sponsor as agencies to get access to all these brand decision makers, but the sponsorship's expensive. It's like again, I think it was like minimum 30 grand, but the package we wanted was 40. We're like we can't invest that in our first South by Southwest. We don't know if anyone's here, we're also in such a saturated space. So instead we did a bit of a brainstorm and like what's okay, we can't take people golfing, so what's the female equivalent of golf? And we realized it's going and getting your nails done with your clients, because golfing and nails, you can't be on your phone because your hands are busy.

27:58
We took over a nail salon and had it entirely rebranded. Busy. We took over a nail salon and had it entirely rebranded. We took down their art, we put up our own art. We had the whole thing decorated with nail your influencer marketing. We gave people nail files with nail your influencer marketing. Anyone who worked in brand marketing men or women could come and get manicures and pedicures and we did a whole series of. We did a whole day. That was less than half the cost of the brand innovator sponsorship.

28:22 - Mike (Host)
Yeah, and was memorable, it was an experience. Yeah, and we didn't.

28:26 - Jennifer (Guest)
Interestingly, we won clients from South by Southwest, not necessarily from the nail salon, but people talked about the nail salon and we met people who are now clients because of it. So it's just like I think doing something different and leaning into what makes you special and being bold is again really celebrated brilliant jenny.

28:42 - Mike (Host)
It's been a real pleasure. I knew it would be. Thanks for the insights. Where can people find out a lot more about you and digital voices?

28:47 - Jennifer (Guest)
yeah, I post a lot on linkedin. So, jennifer, quickly, jones, hopefully I don't think there's another one, but it's q-u-i-g-l-e-y or at gen qj, I think it normally comes up and then digital voices. You can fast on linkedin as well, instagram or wherever you want, or you can look up digitalvoicescom.

29:05 - Mike (Host)
Brilliant Jenny, thanks ever so much for joining me.

29:07 - Jennifer (Guest)
Thanks, mike, love it.

29:09 - Mike (Host)
Thanks for listening to Higgle the B2B sales club podcast series with your host, mike Lander. Please subscribe so that you'll catch all the next episodes.